Headiche 2C opening (1)

[adhoc3]

Precision.

 

2♣-2♦ 11+ hcps, asking for 4 major.

2♥-?

 

Got a headiche on 2♦ asking. There's no room for testing games as well as giving more informations:

 

2NT, 3♥ are invitation, non forcing;

2♠, showing 5 ♠, usually game forcing but passable;

3♣3♦, not forcing, no fitting ♣♥;

any jump: could be overheated.

 

More problems coming when the opener answer with 2♠.

 

I agreed with my pd with the following modifications:

 

2♣-?

2♦: 11-13 hcps, game trying, opener reply with 4 Major, back to opener's or responcer's suit will be a stop;

2NT: forcing game asking, opener reply with 4 major (3♦ for ♥, 3♥ for ♠, 3♠ for both; relay sequence thereafter).

3♦♥♠: showing 5+cards good suit and game forcing.

 

It seems working but consuming too much space, bringing problems on slam bidding.

 

Any brilliant device here?

 

Thanks for every peice of comment in advance. :P

[helene_t]

2♣-2♦

2♥-2♠

is probaly forcing: with less than GF values you would bid 2♠ immediately. However, I can imagine you would like to have two different invites with spades, with and without tollerance for clubs. You can solve that problem by inverting 2♠ and 2NT after the 2♥ answer to the relay. Thus:

 

2♣-2♠: invite without club tollerance, with 1435 opener passes.

 

2♣-2♦

2♥-2♠: usually invite for 3NT (could also be a strong hand, e.g. with a 4-card spades)

 

2♣-2♦

2♥-2NT: inv+ with spades and club tollerance, opener rebids 3♣ non-forcing without fit (might try 3NT with a super-maximum)

 

2♣-2NT: free for other uses, you could put some strong hands in here which are otherwise awkward.

[Flame]

i used to play this:

http://www.ecatsbridge.com/documents/files...inski+notes.pdf

Its polish but should work in precision, its a bit complex but effective.

[Gerben42]

Should work for both since it is the exact same opening bid.

 

Since it is hard to read here's the translation:

2♣ - 2♦ - ?

2♥: 5/6♣ + 4-card major

2♠: 6♣ + singleton -> 2NT relay

2NT: maximum no singleton

3♣: minimum no singleton

 

2♣ - 2♦ - 2♥ - ?

2♠ relay

2NT: invitation with 4♥

3♣: invitation with 4♠

3♦: invitation with 4-4 majors

 

2♣ - 2♦ - 2♥ - 2♠ - ?

2NT: 5422 (then 3♣ relay)

3♣: 6-4, min.

3♦: 1435

3♥: 3415

3♠: 4135

3NT: 4315

 

2♣ - 2♦ - 2♥ - 2♠ - 2NT - 3♣ - ?

3♦: ♥ min.

3♥: ♥ max.

3♠: ♠ min.

3NT: ♠ max.

 

2♣ - 2♦ - 2♠ - 2NT - ?

3♣: 4♦ or short ♦ (then after 3♦: short ♦ min, short ♦ max., 6♣ 4♦)

3♦: short ♥ min.

3♥: short ♥ max.

3♠: short ♠ min.

3NT: short ♠ max.

 

2♣ - 2NT: Forces 3♣ for several hand types, then after 3♣:

Pass = weak :)

3♦: invitational 5+♥ 5+♠

3M: GF with bad suit

 

2♣ - 3♣♦♥♠: Natural invitation

[Guest Jlall]

If you're looking for something simpler, use 3D over 2M as an artificial GF raise in the major.

[pclayton]

Yeah, I came up with something pretty cool (so I thought)a few years ago. The basic premise is that 2C - 2D didn't promise anything - it just looked for a 4 card major. Opener just bid the 4 card major at the 2 level. A type of lebensohl 2N was used over the 2-of-a-major to get back to clubs.

 

Its not in the notes below, but in response to 2♦: - 2N, 3♣ and 3♦ are all basic precision rebids, but 3♥ shows 5 hearts and 3N shows 5♠. 3♠ shows a solid club suit to keep responder's hand hidden. Its a little complicated, but those that play strong club have come to expect these sequences:)

 

Here's the basic responses after 2C - 2D - 2 Major:

 

2C:

 

---->2D: Typically is looking for opener’s 4-card major, not necessarily a strong hand. Responses:

 

 

---------->2H: 4-card suit; strength vague.

 

--------------->2S: Forcing showing a 5-card or longer suit. A raise by opener typically shows Hx in the suit

 

 

 

---------->2N: Relay to 3C showing either a club signoff or strong raise of the major, or a defined strong major suit raise. RULE: Direct splinters over 2 of a major show support for the major. Delayed splinters via 2N show support for C’s.

--------------->Pass: Club signoff

 

--------------->3D: strong raise of clubs. In response, Opener 'patterns out' - 3 of the other major by opener shows a s/v and 3N shows a 2425. A ‘rebid’ of 3H (opener’s major) specifically shows a s/v diamond.

 

--------------->3H: strong raise in hearts and slam try. Requests a cue bid; Serious 3N is on. This is the only raise of the major via 2N.

 

---------------->3S: (“other major”) void (unknown) splinter raise in support of clubs. Opener relays to 3N for responder to show the void.

 

---------------->3N: splinter raise of clubs, showing a stiff spade.

 

---------------->4C - RKCB bid for clubs. Makes everything “club” focused.

 

---------------->4D - splinter raise of clubs with stiff in suit

 

---------------->4H - splinter raise of clubs with a stiff heart holding a hand like: AQxx, x, Kxx, Axxxx, i.e., checking for a major via 2D and then making a strong raise.

 

---------------->4S - Strong NT raise

 

---------------->4N/5D/H – Exclusion RKCB for C’s (4N= S’s.)

 

 

---------->3C: Limit Raise (10 – 12 HCP, 3+ clubs) in clubs. Opener can continue by bidding fragment (3D/S) to search for NT.

 

---------->3D: Forcing with at least 5 diamonds. Responder probably has the other major and is either concerned about NT or thinks there might be a D slam.

 

---------->3H: Limit raise of opener’s major suit. 3N by opener is a choice of games. Opener can still cue with a monster 2C opener.

 

---------->3S: Void Splinter heart raise (see above)

 

---------->3N: Spade stiff in support of H’s. NOTE: with the balanced 15-17, responder either makes a strong club raise via 2N, bids 3N directly, or otherwise temporizes.

 

---------->4C: splinter raise of major with stiff club (just what partner wanted to hear!)

 

---------->4D: Singleton splinter in support of major.

 

---------->4H: Signoff

 

---------->4S: RKCB

 

 

 

----->2S:

 

---------->2N: Relay to 3C showing either a club signoff or strong raise, or a defined strong major suit raise.

 

---------------->Pass: Club signoff

 

---------------->3D: Strong raise of clubs. 3 of a major by opener shows a s/v and 3N shows a 4225.

 

---------------->3H: Void splinter for clubs (mirrors similar sequence over 2H – 2N –3C.)

 

---------------->3S: Strong raise in spades and slam try. Requests a cue bid; Serious 3N is on.

 

---------------->3N: Spade splinter in support of clubs,

 

---------------->4C: RKCB for clubs

 

---------------->4D: Splinter raise of clubs with stiff in suit

 

---------------->4H: Splinter raise of clubs with stiff in suit

 

---------------->4S Mild slam try in spades; note this differs from: 2C-2D-2H-2N-4H.

 

---------------->4N/5D/5H Exclusion RKCB for clubs (4N= spades.)

 

 

---------->3C: Limit Raise in clubs.

 

---------->3D: Forcing with at least 5 diamonds

 

---------->3H: void splinter for clubs to mirror the similar sequences following the 2H rebid.

 

---------->3S: Limit raise of opener’s major suit. 3N by opener is a choice of games. Opener can still cue with a monster 2C opener.

 

---------->3N: Heart stiff in support of spades. NOTE: with the balanced 15-17, either makes a strong club raise via 2N/3D or bid 3N directly.

 

---------->4C: splinter in support of major.

 

---------->4D: splinter in support of major.

 

---------->4H: splinter in support of spades.

 

---------->4S: Signoff

[Rebound]

FWIW what follows may be somewhat simplistic, but it has worked well for me and my precision partner for some time without placing too much of a burden on memory.

 

We use 2M and 3M respectively to indicate min/max (where the opening is limited to 15 HCP). 2NT indicates 2 suits stopped outside of clubs (3♦ asks which ones), and a simple rebid of 3♣ shows a minimum w/out a 4CM.

 

I realize it has some basic flaws, but it's easy to remember and it seems to work more often than not.

 

Apologies if this is too basic or irrelevant if there is no upper limit on 2♣.

[Double !]

FWIW what follows may be somewhat simplistic, but it has worked well for me and my precision partner for some time without placing too much of a burden on memory.

 

We use 2M and 3M respectively to indicate min/max (where the opening is limited to 15 HCP). 2NT indicates 2 suits stopped outside of clubs (3♦ asks which ones), and a simple rebid of 3♣ shows a minimum w/out a 4CM.

 

I realize it has some basic flaws, but it's easy to remember and it seems to work more often than not.

 

Apologies if this is too basic or irrelevant if there is no upper limit on 2♣.

FWIW

I believe that this was the original response structure in terms of opener's rebids with 4-card majors in the sequence 2C - 2D.

 

DHL

[Robert]

hello everyone

 

2C-2D asks-2H*=I have 'a' 4 card major-2S*(asks)-2NT=hearts, 3C=spades(min.)

and 3D=spades max.

 

2C-2D-2S*=min. values, no 4M. Responder bids 2NT or 3C to play.

 

2C-2D-2NT=natural max. values.(tends to be 6223 or 7222)

 

2C-2D-3C=natural max. values(tends to be unbal. 6331 or AKQ(J) type clubs)

 

I use a 2C opening that shows 6+ clubs.

 

I like to play 2C-2NT as 'two way' either a normal invite 'or' game forcing with a 5 card major. Opener must 'sign off' with 3C or bid his 3 card fragments to show a max. hand. This avoids the problem of opener wondering whether to raise on Hx or xx after 2C-2D-any-3M?

 

Regards,

Robert

[adhoc3]

Here're 5 solutions (including my own) and many precious comments, from the most simple and practical towards the most complex and precise, of which Robert's is the easist to fit myself into.

 

Thank you ♥♥♥