sniwas1

Thank you Tola18 for balanced comments. Your analysis is very correct. Many have expressed that, the manner in which TD acted is not big deal. However my perspective is much different from theirs. I would like to clarify on one point however. I got in touch with the TD after the tourney began, not when TD was about ot launch it. I did not know who TD was; so I had tried to send chat to the Host, but got the message that, he was either not on line or was invisible. I would repeat that, even if the TD would have told me that, unregistering us was a genuine mistake/error and was unintentional, the matter would not have come to such a pass. However, TD chose otherwise and BBO's clarfication shocked me. I think it would be better now to put this matter to rest. sniwas1

I am sorry, Uday, that, you have skirted the main issue. sniwas1

It seems lady_bb has ire against swan and is envious of its owner. I don't wish to say more about her post, as it does not tackle the main issue but diverts to something irrelevent. I shall ignore her further posts if any. sniwas1

On reading your response, I wish to state as under: 1. If BBO'sresponse was correct and if BBO does not unregister offline pairs, is the TD's saying that, BBO removed us justified? Do you mean to say that, TD was not aware of what BBO software does or does not do? 2. You have indicated the possibility that, through some genuine mistake, our pair might have been unregistered. Well, I can understand that. But then it would have been proper on TD's part to tell me such possibility and not tell me that it's BBO who did it. If I were TD, I would have told whatever fact was and also say 'sorry for the inconvenience caused' or someting like that. I have nothing against the TD, as I find that, the TD conducts the tourney in a very jovial way, which is very entertaining. However, this unregistration of our pair and supply of wrong information as to why it happened was very disturbing. However, I must admit that, many of those who reacted to my post failed to see my main point which was of principle and of the need to take steps to improve matters, where need be. I find that, even the suggestion of reasonable regualtion of activities is shunned. In fact, we experienced what lack of adequate regulation leads to and yet, many of us seem to be averse to it. sniwas1

Hi babalu:) Nice to see you reacting on my post. Thank you.:)) What you say is perhaps right. However, I am sure, from your last statement, that, that, you are in general agreement with my post. Hope we play someday soon. sniwas1

Many of us play at different bridge sites. I also do that. But that's not the point. This post is trying to divert attention from the main issue for no reason. Instead of expressing or making suggestion on the point raised in my original post, extraneous issues are being brought in, whic are irrelevent in the present case. I am not bothering BBO managers with my personal problems. What I experienced could be the fate of others as well. What I have tried to stress is that, TDs use their freedom with responsibility. OneTD did not do that in the case that has been cited. In order that, this type of incident does not recur in future, BBO may issue certain guidelines to be followed by TDs. I don't think I have suggested anything difficult to follow or anything against aybody. I appreciate the generosity of Mr. Fred Gitelman for developing this site so well. It is all the more necessary, therefore that, Organisers of Tourneys and TDs, who give their valuable time to condut tourneys, also do their best to adopt ways to conduct tourneys in the best possible manner. That's all. There should be transperancy in actions and rules being followed. Nothing more. I don't have time to play bridge all the time as I have other things to attend to. So it is not worthwhile for me to become a paid member at more than one site. sniwas1

Please note the following please. 1. My self and my pard were in BBO, 4 mins before tourney start time. 2. BBO says that, we were not unregistered by BBO but by TD. 3. TD tells that, BBO unregisters offline pairs at the 2 min mark. We were there 4 mins before tourney start time. This means BBO can not have unregistered us. So it follows that, TD unregistered us. Means TD was misrepresenting facts in the present case. Should this be acceptable? I am surprised if the contention is that in free tourneys all sorts of things are permissible. Whether free or paid, when a tourney is conducted, the same rules should apply. Tourney is a tourney. Time is valuable. Unregistering a pair without sufficient reason must be viewed seriously. This should not depend upon luck, but upon satisfaction of certain specific criteria. Freedom must be enjoyed with responsiblity. Hope you will agree, jillybean. sniwas1 sniwas1

It does not matter whether the actions of the TD were justifiable, with few exceptions BBO lets TDs run their games as they see fit. Choosing whether and when to unregister players is something that is left to the TD. Whether this TD lied about BBO's role is something that should be between the TD and BBO. If BBO is not concerned about the possible damage to their reputation, neither should you be. I am very disappointed to read this post. Because it is my firm view that, IT DEFINITELY MATTERs whether TD's actions are justifiable or not. Everyone, including a TD, must be accountable for his actions. TDs must have the freedom to run their games, but at the same time, they should be responsible to do it in a fair and transperant manner. Whether and when to unregister a pair should be decided by TD but such an action should be subject to certain guidelines to be laid down by BBO. These guidelines should be clear cut and specific. This will ensure uniformity in case of all tourneys. I totally disagree that, the matter of falsehood is a matter only between BBO and the TD, because BBO members, in case of whom it happened, are affected as well. It's a serious matter and needs to be dealt with as such. There needs to be accountability in such matters. Being member of BBO, I consider that, my as well as BBO's image is important. sniwas1

I wish to state as under. I agree that a complaint to TD should suffice. I had initially complained to TD only. But her replies were not convincing and so I had to report to BBO. I have no complaint at all about pruning offline players to avoid empty seats at start of tourney. But time limit specified fo the same should be strictly observed. In the present case, it was not observed. The start time was also not advanced by 2 mins as my verificaton of time left for start of tourney from the display had confirmed. If it was a mistake, the same sould be accepted gracefully and not involve BBO unnecessarily by saying that, BBO did it and nothing is in my hands. If mistake was accepted gracefuly, I would not have approached BBO with a complaint, as I can understand that, mistakes do happen. But this was not done and over and above that, false information was provided, putting the blame on BBO unnecessarily in the process, which hurts. Thank you for your kind post helen_t. sniwas1

I am surprised that, you have not understood at all what I have said. I have never said that, offline players should not be removed from registered list. If some specific time limit has been specified for this purose, it must be observed. When the time limit was to be 2 mins (as told by TD herself), and when both of us there 4 mins before tourney start time, there was no justification for our removal. This is the point. And when this was told to TD, TD saying that, de-registration was done by BBO and not by TD was supplying false information, as BBO has clarified that, BBO plays no part in removal of pairs registered for a tourney. Is the behaviour of TD in the present case still justificable? If TDs go on doing this under BBO's name, when BBO is not involved, is it not abuse of freedom, as BBO does not normally interfer in what TDs do? Lastly, the statement that, 'I personally think of this talk of deceipt by BBO is nonsense' is arrogant. I have not said 'deceipt by BBO'. Here is no case of BBO deceiving. I have said 'deceipt of BBO members', which is not by BBO but by a TD. Would help if the post is read more carefully. I am aware of the pains TDs have to take to conduct a tournament successfully. However, that does not mean that, some TDS can behave the way a TD did in the present case. Lastly, If I were not in BBO for a while, my pard was there all the time. Before de-registering our pair, my pard could have been contacted by the TD before cancellation to assess the situation. Whether to remain logged in or whether to log out and relog in sufficiently prior to tourney start time is everybody's choice. sniwas

I experienced something extraordinary in BBO, which I wish to share with you all. The purpose is to share views in the context of what happened in a particular case, details of which are as below. Myself and my partner 'yasmin' were registered for a tourney rin BBO recently. After registering us, I had logged out of BBO, as I had to attend to something and as 14 mins were still left for the tourney to start. When I logged back in BBO, my pard told me that, perhaps I was too late as our registration was cancelled while I was away. I immediately checked if tourney had started already. But I found that, there were still 4 mins to go before it could start. We were surprised. I tried to re-register us, but then maximum number of registered players had been reached and so I could not re-register us. While I was telling this to my partner, the tourney started. I then got in chat the Tourney Director, who was conducting the tourney and asked her how our registration was cancelled. She told me that, if a pair is offline 2 mins before tourney start time, the pair gets removed to accomodate other pairs. I told her that, I had logged back in 4 mins before tourney start time and my pard was all the time logged on in BBO. So we both were in BBO 4 mins before tourney start time. On that, her reply was that, the pairs are removedby BBO and not by her and so it is not in her hands. To ascertain the correct position and also as we thought that, in the context of the policy regarding removal of already registered pairs as explained by the Tourney Director, we should not have been removed from the Tourney, I wrote to BBO administration requesting BBO administration to look into this cancellation of registration for no fault on our part and causing us a lot of inconvenience. We felt that, as we plan our time to play in tourneys, if such is the action taken by either Tournament administrators or BBO, which causes wastage of time of members, then it's bad and needs to be looked into and the situation corrected forthwith. BBO 's reply was as under: "BBO doesn't clear offline players. In your case TD did it. But we believe in letting the free market forces determine which tourneys are worth joining, which aren't. This is especially true for the free tourneys. The player always has the right to choose which tourney he wants to play or help out in. Similarly, TDs can adjust their rules (some never adjust anything, time or whatever), they can be sterner or nicer, etc. They can choose to direct for just their friends, or for everyone. We interfere only if the TD is doing something wrong like giving their friends top boards. So if this isn't the case here, please try to join other tourneys in the future if you don't like this TD's style." I informed BBO about my disappointment regarding the above reply from BBO. Main reason for my disappointment was that, it was clear from BBO's reply that, although cancellation of our tourney registration was done by TD of the Organisers of the tournament, the TD was telling me that, BBO had done it and that, nothing was in her hands. This was nothing but utter falsehood,as is clear from BBO's reply. The TD had put the blame for the wrongful action on the part of BBO instead of admitting wrong action, which was on their part. And again, in spite of this happening, BBO, it appears, did not think that, TD had done something wrong. Is telling falsehood not far more serious than wrong actions on the part of TD like giving top board to ther friends? The question here is not only of joining or not joining tourneys conducted by a particular Tourney Director, but is of whether such falsehood on the part of TD, when it comes to light, should be condoned by BBO or should be dealt with strictly by BBO, so that, such instances don't recur in future. Such instances will contnue to occur, if this tendency of falsifyig facts, which is nothing but irresponsible behavior, is not checked by BBO expediously. I, therefore, am of the firm opinion that, BBO frame some specific guidelines/rules for conduction of tourneys in BBO by Individuals/Organisations/Clubs, flouting of which should attract severe penalties. A number of such issues might have come to BBO's knowledge in the past. Taking into account these, such guidelines need to be framed or if some guidelines are already existing, they need to be suitably modified, so that, such injustice is not meted out to BBO members and image of BBO is also not unnecessarily tarnished in the eyes of its members in future. The present case is a straighforward case of deceipt of BBO members and of maligning the image of BBO at the same time without any justification. It is a case of 'Abuse of Freedom granted by BBO in good faith for fair conduction of tourneys in BBO.' It is necessary that, BBO administration,recognizing the value of time of its members and of the necessity of maintaining certain standards to be observed at the site being administered by itself, insists upon Tournament Organisers to respect these too. I hope that, this incident serves as an eye opener for those who have concern about BBO's image and fair play in conduction of tourneys in BBO. Tanks ALL. sniwas1