Hilver

Just pass. Partner has ears, eyes and brains.

Google for ''Multi-Defense'' and You have got the answer.

Take a look at the solution in Revision Club. The disadvantage is You would have to learn a completely new bidding system :-( You can download The Revision Club at http://www.geocities.com/daniel_neill_2000/sys/

Revision club is perhaps not the best system for 'learning precision' - it's nowhere near how precision is commonly played, and is a bit complicated for beginning to learn to play a strong club system. Well, I do agree Your remark about The Revion Club. After having studied a ''simple'' book on Precision, Revison is a good follow up. I strongly recommend any serious bridgeplayer - novice or expert - to read Foreword and Introduction of John Montgomery's book.

The book I used to learn Precision in the eighties was '' The Precision system of contract bridge bidding'' written by Charles Goren. It was Chancellor Hall Book published by Doubleday & Company, Inc. Garden City New York. It's a well wriiten and simple version of Precision. Of course there are may other books as mentioned by others. I would also advise You to take a look at The Revision Club. It is a good write up and well documented version of Precision developed by John Montgomery (USA). You should at least read Foreword and Introduction of his book. You can download this book for free at http://www.geocities.com/daniel_neill_2000/sys/. I recommend it very much.

I played this convention for several years and just used simple constructive bidding. 3C?D = to play 3H/S = forcing to game in bid M 3NT = to play 4C/D = strong, staring control bidding 4H/S = to play, sign off 5C/D = to play, maybe preemptive Defense: dbl = 15+ 3C = strong, better H then S, at least 5/4 3D = strong, better S then H, at least 5/4 3H/S = 12-15, (5)/6+-card M

For two years now I play a modified version of Revision Club and play 2♣ and 2♦ in the way You described it. In practise it works out well.

So has anyone actually tried the "Revision" ideas out, either on BBO or IRL tournaments? Rewvision was released in October 2005. Since June 2006 my pard and I use a modified version of Revision. We do use the basic principles of Revision. These basic principles are okay. We are just average players but we score satisfying results. If things go wrong, it's not the systems fault but ours :-( Why we don't play the full version of the original Revision? Very simple, we are as stubborn as one can be :-)

Take a look at Daniels 'System Page http://www.geocities.com/daniel_neill_2000/sys/ and download Revison Club. At least Foreword and Introduction are worthwile reading. Revison Club is a well documented system.

I think shading the 1♦...2N jump rebid to 17-18 is tolerable, but probably not great. You will also have to worry about the 17-18 5M332 hands in the auctions 1M-1N-? 1♥-1♠-? I guess you have to raise to 2N here with 17-18 balanced? I don't know if you use a forcing 1N in response to 1M, but if you do, you might need to increase the strength standards to response if you'll get raised to 2N sometimes and might otherwise be too high. A balanced 17-18 NT is always opened as 1D and denies a 5 card M. A 17-18 5M332 is always bid by 1C. After partner response you introduce your 5-card M. A balanced 17-18 NT is always opened as 1D and denies a 5 card M. A 17-18 5M332 is always bid by 1C. After partner response you introduce your 5-card M. Up to now we do use quite natural rebids. That's fine. For instance: 1C - (pass) - 1D - (pass) 2NT = 21-22 HCP 1C - (pass) - 1D - (pass) 2H - (pass) - 2S - (pass) 2NT = 22-23 HCP (2H is Kokish = either GF hearts or 21-22 or 23+ HCP) (2S = relay) 1C - (pass) - 1D - (pass) 2D = 4-4-4-1 16-24 HCP

Suppose You are using a strong club system in which the opening bid of 1C is 16+ HCP. In this system an opening bid of 1NT is 16-18 balanced. You have the intention to change this in a 14-16 1NT, balanced. Another feature of this biddingsystem is that opening 2NT shows a balanced 19-20 HCP. So how do You bid a balanced 17-18 HCP? In the auction: 1C - (pass) - 1D - (pass) 1NT is 1NT an unbalanced hand with 5+ card D and 16+ HCP. So You can't use the 1NT-rebid by OH indicating 17-18 HCP, balanced. Well, what about this option: 1D = 10-18 HCP, 2+ card D and denying a 5 card in hearts or spades. In the auction: 1D - (pass) - 1H/S - (pass) 1NT then should be (11) 12-13 HCP, balanced and in 1D - (pass) - 1H/S - (pass) 2NT should be a balanced 17-18 HCP (without 5-card H or S). How big is the risk of overbidding jumping to 2NT with a 17-18 HCP when partner has bid 1H/S promising 6+ HCP and a 4+ card in that suit? What's Your opinion about this option of bidding a 17-18 HCP balanced in this way? What are the arguments in favour of this approach and what are the arguments against this method? (Don't critize the meaning of 1NT in 1C-(pass) - 1D -(pass) as this part of the system is okay. I do play this bidding system for two years now and it's no problem. Up to now the opening bid of 1NT is 16-18, balanced but I am investigating the arguments to change that in a 14-16 HCP balanced.) Thanks. Jan Veerbeek

I am interested in a convention called Switch (or Switch Plus). As far as I know this convention has been invented by Marty Bergen. Switch t is used in this way: When your opponent overcalls your minor-suit opening with 1S, you switch the responses of the other two suits at the two-level. Opener Overcaller Responder 1 D 1 S ? 2H by responder shows clubs 2C by responder shows hearts The advantage of switching is that you keep the guy who overcalled on lead when you find a fit. (He may have made a lead-directing bid with say A-Q of his suit behind opener's king.) Another example: Opener Overcaller Responder 1 S 2 D 3 C = hearts 1 D 2 H 3 C = spades 1 C 1 H 2 D = a one-spade response The concept behind Switch is: Keep the hand with the strength on opening lead. If You are acquainted with this convention, would You be so kind as to share Your experiences? Thanks, Hilver

L.S. What could be the advantage of opening 1NT with a balanced 14-16 count in stead of 12-14,13-15, 15-17 or 16-18? Someone aquainted with a 14-16 NT? What's Your opinon about this? Jan Veerbeek

In my version of Precision - Revison Club Modified - that's not a major problem. The 1♣-opener has either a strong balanced hand - 21+ HCP - or an unbalanced hand. I know some hate it, but the opening bid of 1NT is 16-18 HCP and the opening bid of 2NT is 19-20 HCP. So with a minimum hand opener will pass after 1♣-(pass)-1♦-(2Y) with a 16-18 unbalanced hand and bid something else with a strong balanced hand or an 19+ unbalanced hand. 1♦ in Revision can be weak, strong or intermediate. It denies several weak hands with 0-7 HCP and 5+cards in a suit.

The way I respond after OH opening 1♣ and RHO making a takeout double: pass: 0-4 HCP 1D: no 5-card major, 5-8 HCP 1H/S/2C/2D: 5-8 HCP 5-card 2H/S/3C/3D: 5-8 HCP, 6+-card redouble: 9+ HCP 1♣ -(1D/H/S) - ?: pass: 0-4 HCP New suit without jump: 5-8 HCP, 5 card New suit with jump: 6+card, 5-8 HCP 1NT: 6-8 HCP, stopper, no 5-card 2NT: 9-11 HCP, stopper, no 5-card 3NT: 12-14 HCP, stopper, no 5 card double: 5-8 HCP without 5+card or 9+ HCP (several possibilities, i.e. strong one suited hand) Cuebid: singleton or renonce in overcallers suit and a two or 3 suited hand After 1♣-(2C/D/H/S) - ?: almost the same structure as after 1♣ - (1D/H/S) After 1♣ - 2NT or higher overcall: double: punishment suit: GF NT: to play Hilver

IMP's N/NS red North has: S: A K T x x x H: A x D: J x x C: J x Bidding went: North South ----- ----- 1S* 2D** 2S*** 3C**** 3D 3H***** 3NT 4C 4D 5C ? * 11-15 HCP, 5+ spades ** Forcing to game, 5+ diamonds, could have longer clubs but definitely not 5 hearts *** 6+ spades, no 4 hearts **** At least 5-5 in the minors, no 2 spades ***** asks for stopper in hearts 3NT naturally promises a heart stopper. What is Your next bid sitting North and why? Thanks

IMP's N/NS red North has: S: A K T x x x H: A x D: J x x C: J x Bidding went: North South ----- ----- 1S* 2D** 2S*** 3C**** 3D 3H***** 3NT 4C 4D 5C ? * 11-15 HCP, 5+ spades ** Forcing to game, 5+ diamonds, could have longer clubs but definitely not 5 hearts *** 6+ spades, no 4 hearts **** At least 5-5 in the minors, no 2 spades ***** asks for stopper in hearts 3NT naturally promises a heart stopper. What is Your next bid sitting North and why? Thanks

Opening 2C with only 5 clubs isn't always fun, indeed. So I play 2C as 6+ card clubs, a 4-card major is possible. It's very suitable in practise.

Since June 2006 my pard and I play (a modified version of) John Montgomery's Revision Club. We use his basic princples as outlined. I can confirm that many times you respond 1D after a 1C-opening bid. That's no problem at all. After the openingbid of 1C and the 1D response most rebids are quite natural. All I can say is, playing this system is a pleausure. It's a well-thought-out bidding system and worthwile more then just a fast glance. At least Foreword and Inbtroduction of his free book (over 350 pages) should be read by any bridgeplayer, whatever biddingsystem You may use! Just give it a try. I agree. The Introduction and Foreword are worth the price of the book :rolleyes: I just have a hard time finding anyone to play it with me. One of the advantages of having the 1D response being either weak or 8+ HCP is that fourth hand can't decide to jump into the bidding because of a 1D negative response to a strong club opening bid. He doesn't know if it is negative or not until later rounds of bidding. The true negative responses, 1H through 2H, have the advantage that they have told opener something about the shape and strength of the hand. If fourth hand enters the auction, opener is better able to judge what action should be taken. I hope you do realize that the opposite can also be stated: the disadvantage of an ambiguous 1♦ is that opener will not know how strong it is. At least after a positive bid opener will know of some distributional feature! In reality it's no problem. 1. The 1C-bidder has either an unbalanced hand with 16+ HCP or has a strong balanced hand (21+ HCP). If he has a minmum hand the 1C-bidder may pass. 2. The 1D-bidder knows his partner has a balanced strong or unbalanced hand. So he can very well judge the situation. After an experience of almost one year and a half, no problem at the table.

Since June 2006 my pard and I play (a modified version of) John Montgomery's Revision Club. We use his basic princples as outlined. I can confirm that many times you respond 1D after a 1C-opening bid. That's no problem at all. After the openingbid of 1C and the 1D response most rebids are quite natural. All I can say is, playing this system is a pleausure. It's a well-thought-out bidding system and worthwile more then just a fast glance. At least Foreword and Inbtroduction of his free book (over 350 pages) should be read by any bridgeplayer, whatever biddingsystem You may use! Just give it a try.

What about this structure of responses to 1♣? My pard and I use this structure in The Revision Club, a Big Club bidding system. 1♥ / ♠: 0-7 HCP, 5+-card 1NT: 4♥ and 4♠, 0-7 HP 2♣ / ♦: 6+-card, 0-7 HCP. at most a doubleton in the other minor 2♥: 4-7 HCP, 5+ card ♥ and ♠ 2♠: 8-11 HCP, any 4-4-4-1 2NT: 12+ HCP, any 4-4-4-1 3♣ / ♦: 5-7 HCP in the minor, 7+ card 3♥ / ♠: 5-7 HCP in the major, 7+-card 3NT: Gambling NT (A long minor, headed by AKQ)) 4♣ / ♦: Namyats 1♦: relay, excludes the above mentioned responses; maybe weak, intermediate or strong. Most of the time You will respond 1♦. The advantage is that opener will bid his suit and You will never respond NT with a balanced hand and 7-14 HCP.

Playing some kind of Precision, opening 1♦ is 11-15 HCP and 2+-card ♦, denying a five card in one of the majors, what should 2♠ be in this auction: You LHO Partner 1♦ 1♠ 2♠ Should 2♠ be: 1. at least 10+ HCP and at least 4-card ♦ support, denying 4-cxard ♥ or 2. just asking for a ♠ stopper? A second bidding sequence: You LHO Partner 1♦ 1♠ 3♦ Should 3♦ promise: 1. 10-11 HCP and a good 5+-card ♦ support, denying 4-card ♥ or 2. weak jump support, 0-5 HCP and 5/6+ card ♦ support? What are Your agreements in these situations? Thx.

Autumn 2005 I printed John Montgomery's book on The Revision Club. Like some others I was impressed by this welltimbered book. Every serious bridgeplayer should at least read foreword and introduction of The Revision Club. Starting a new partnership and looking for a bidding system to use, my pard and I decided to choose a Big Club system. We hunted in the bookshop and at the WWW. Studying Montgomery's book I really was impressed by it. The book contains a lot of new and interesting ideas and maybe You don't like them at all, at least it makes You thinking about an esential part of the game, bidding. My pard and I did! From October 2005 untill May 2006 we spent hours and hours on discussing The Revision Club. For me one of the most attractive ideas of Revision is the structure of responses after opening 1C. The idea of showing weak hands with a major suit immedeately and using the response of 1D as a relay for either weak (without a 5+-card major), average or strong hands does work. Also the other responses after partner opening 1C are effective. The idea of removing the strong balanced hands with 16-20 HCP from the 1C-openingbid has been a good idea. The opening bid of 1D causes no great problems in partnership bidding, maybe just for the opponents. I have to admit that my pard and I at some parts developed our own ideas, but we basically do use John Montgomery's inventions and especially the basic structure of his responses after opening 1C. My pard and I now use our modified version of Revision since June 2006 and all I can say is: 1. bidding is great fun; 2. the bidding system is effective; if things go wrong in 95 out of 100 it's our mistake and not the systems blunder. Why we play a modified version? Not because we don't trust John Montgomery's full version - as I wrote above we highly admire and appreciate his great work and we use a lot of his inventions!- but simply we are as bloody-minded as one can be :-). Moreover my pard and I are just modest players. All I can say is, give it a try, it does work! Hilver

Consider the following start of the bidding: You partner 1S 2H ... (1S = 5+-card and 12+ HCP) Two questions A) If 2H is not gameforcing, what would a jump to 4C or 4D show now. Do you prefer this to be a splinter or a control bid or even something else? B) What if 2H is gameforcing? Is your answer the same? Thanks

[hv=d=w&v=n&s=skq9764hada2ck1075]133|100|Scoring: IMP Playing a strong club, what is Your next bid sitting West with this holding? Please, explain Your choice. West East 1♣ 1♦ 1♠ 2♣ ? 1♣ 16+ HCP 1♦ relay, could be a weak, average or strong hand. Denies several weak hands in all suits. 1♠ 16-21 HCP, 5+-card 2♣ 8+ HCP, 4+-card, gameforcing Bidding will continue in a natural way [/hv]