hylins

The dilemma is who is going to start exploring the slam possibility and how? The weaker 2♣ responder(North)? or the strong balanced 2♣ opener(South)? Using the Precision-like transfer style responses, the captain is the strong 2♣ opener most if not all of the time. https://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/83851-a-new-transfer-style-responses-to-the-strong-2c-opening/page__p__1006357__fromsearch__1#entry1006357 2♣ 2♥ (4+, 5+ cards ♠) 2♠* 3♦ (4-9, 5-card ♠ with one of the ♠AKQ) 2♠* is the Precision Trump Asking Bid (TAB). After hearing the 3♦ response, the 2♣ opener can smell the slam and also be the declarer. The question is now 6♠ or 7♠.

2♣ is much simple and clear as 1♦ is a very busy bid.

At 12-17, the 1♣ and 1♦ bids of DMF(Dual Minor Forcing) approach focus on the 4-card Major holding and pay no attention to the number of minor. 1♣ can be 4324, 4351, 4360 (at least 2-card ♦) 1♦ can be 4414, 4450 (at least 1-card ♦)

In order to make the opp's preempt less effective and difficult, DMF(Dual Minors Forcing) approach borrowed Polish club's 3-way 1♣ concept. However, the 1♣ bid of DMF approach was structured very differently from Polish club's 1♣ bid. Together with its newly introduced forcing 1♦ twin bid, DMF could solve most if not all of the problems that Polish Polish 1♣ bid encountered. To answer your question about the rebids after one opp's specific preempt, allow me to do it in a different way, a more general way. Let us try one high level preempt example of 1♣-(3♥)-Pass-Pass-??. After the strong Polish 1♣ bid, opp preempts with 3♥ and then 2 passes follow. What will the Polish 1♣ opener bid now? Besides T/O X or Penalty X, one of the following 4 possible holdings (Balanced, 1 suitor, 2 suitor, 3 suitor, before even counting the many different suit combinations) is what the opener wants to communicate to his partner. How will this be accomplished when the available bids are very limited? It is a Mission Impossible! This same problem also occurs in most of the other systems (Strong Club, Standard, 2/1, ...). In the DMF approach, the strong 1♣ bid of Polish Club system or other systems has been designed into the combo of (a)strong 1♣ bid and (b)strong 1♦ bid. In the case of strong 1♣ bid (Balanced or 2 suitor), the rebids can be as simple and clearly as Pass If you wish X Penalty (most likely when having good ♥ suit and balanced hand) 3♠ ♠+minor 55 (NF, 18-22, for example) 3N Balanced (23+ ?) 4♣ minors 55 (NF, 18-22 ?) 4♦ minors 55 (GF, 23+ ?) 4♥ TBD (To Be Defined) 4♠ ♠+minor 55 (GF, 23+ ?) For the case of strong 1♦ bid (1 suitor or 3 suitor), the rebids can now become Pass If you wish X Penalty (most likely when one of your 3-suit is ♥ suit) 3♠ One suitor (relays to 3N, or partner bid his own suit?) 3N To play if you wish 4♣ 4144 (NF, 18-22, for example) 4♦ 4144 (GF, 23+, ?) 4♥ TBD 4♠ TBD As illustrated in the example above, it is very clear that DMF's 1♣ and 1♦ twin bids can do much better than Polish Club's strong 1 ♣ bid after opp's preempt bid. I believe this advanatage can be extended to the case of (1) 12-17 holding and (2) opp's lower level preempt. By the way, the 1♣ bid in Polish Club system is a 3-way heavily loaded bid. In other words, it has too many possible meanings. (1) 12–14 HCP, no 5-card Major, no 4-card ♦ suit. (2) 15–17 HCP, 5-card ♣, unbalanced distribution. (3) 18+ HCP, any distribution. In addition to the normal Strong Club's holding (3), the Polish 1♣ bid includes holdings (1) and (2) to make the opp's preempt less effective and difficult. However, when opps does preempt especially with a high level bid, the Polish 1♣ opener has a big problem to clarify which of the many possible strong holdings he has. DMF approach was developed by structuring most of those many possible holdings in (1) (2) (3) into two twin bids, 1♣ and 1♦, to help solve the holding clarifing problems with or without opp's preempt!

Opener's rebids over 1♣-1♠ is very simliar to Opener's rebids over 1♣-1♥. (1.3) 1♣-1♠ 8+, 4+ cards ♠ 1NT 12-17, 4-card ♥, may have weak 5-card ♦ 2♣ GF 55, or Balanced 23+ 2♦ 15-17, Good 5+ cards ♦ and 4-card ♥ 2♥ 18-19, ♥+minor 55 2♠ 12-14, 4-card ♠ 2NT 20-22, Balanced 3♣ 18-19, minor 55 3♦ 20-22, minor 55 3♥ 20-22, ♥+minor 55 3♠ 15-16, 4-card ♠ 3NT 18-19, Balanced 4♣ Splinter-♣, 4-card ♠ 4♦ Splinter-♦, 4-card ♠ 4♥ Splinter-♥, 4-card ♠ 4♠ Good 16-17, 4-card ♠ 4NT RKC-♠

The opening bids of DMF(Dual Minors Forcing) system can be summarized as: 1♣ - (a) 12-17, One and only one 4-card Major suit, or (b) 18+, 2 suitors, or Balanced 1♦ - (a) 12-17, None or both 4-card Major suits, or (b) 18+, 3 suitors, or 1 suitor 1♥ - 12-17, 5+ ♥ suit 1♠ - 12-17, 5+ ♠ suit 1NT - 15-17 2♣ - 12-17, one 5-card ♣ suit plus any 2nd 4-card suit, or one 6+ cards ♣ suit. 2♦ - 7-11, 6+ card suits in one of the Majors (if Multi is not allowed, then 6+ card ♦) 2♥ - 7-11, 55 in ♥ and any 2nd suit (if Multi is not allowed, then 6+ card ♥) 2♠ - 7-11, 55 in ♠ and a minor suit (if Multi is not allowed, then 6+ card ♠) 2NT - 7-11, 55 in minors 3NT - gambling, no side stopper 4♣ - NAMYATS 4♦ - NAMYATS 3♣/3♦/3♥/3♠/4♥/4♠ - Preempt

Treat them like 1-suitor and open 1♦.

The One or Both Majors approach has 3 cases to be clarified and it will take at least 2 bids to do so in average. The "Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing" approach was designed to allow only two very different holdings in each of the 1♣ and 1♦ bids. Therefore, one can easily tell which holding it is with only 1 bid most of the time when the Exclusive method is used.

I prefer to extend the Precision 2♣ opening bid to cover both 12-17 hcps, (31)45 and 2245 holdings!

Just use the bids (1♥ and up) of Precision system or Polish Club system with modified opening HCP range. The new things are in the 1♣ and 1♦ bids.

"Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing (DMF)" approach Among all the opening bids in most of the bidding systems, 1♦ bid is the most ambiguous bid which becomes clear only after the opener’s 2nd bid. As we all know, the Standard system such as 2/1 and SAYC opens 1 level bid over a wide range of 12-21 HCPS. One might have experienced opening 18-19 HCPS, 4423 with 1♣ and then hearing 3 passes when one's partner holds 4432 and 4 HCPSs. The Strong 1♣ system is helpful to avoid this awkward situation, but opponents will do preemptive interference to make the responses to the 1♣ bid difficult at any opportunity they have. The Polish Club system introduced the 3-way 1♣ bid to greatly reduce effectiveness of an opponent's preemptive interference. However, the ambiguous 1♦ bid still remains untouched. In this article, the concept of “Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing” was explored by restructuring both 1♣ and 1♦ bids as a forcing 2-way bid respectively. They will each show different 4-card Major holdings for the 12-17 HCPS hands, while showing different holdings in number of suits for strong 18+ HCPS Hands. This “Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing” approach shall achieve the advantages of 1) narrowing the wide opening range of 1 level suit opening in the Standard system to 6 HCPS. 2) further reducing the effectiveness of an opponent's preemptive interference against the Strong 1♣ bid. 3) showing different 4-card Major holdings with both forcing 1♣ and 1♦ bids which have never been attempted before by any other systems. Using this “Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing” approach, one would open with 1♣ when holding (1) 12-17 HCPS hand with ONLY ONE 4-card Major, or (2) 18+ hand with 2-suit or Balanced distribution, and open with 1♦ when holding (1) 12-17 HCPS hand with BOTH 4-card Majors or NO 4-card Major, or (2) 18+ HCPS hand with 1-suit or 3-suit distribution. Simply speaking, this new Dual Minors 1♣/1♦ Forcing appraoch modifies the Precision system by (1) making both 1♣ and 1♦ bids forcing bids and (2) having two opening HCP ranges of 12-17 and 18+ such that the 2/1 system's 1NT bid can be used directly. The underlined responses to 1♣ bid shown below are very natural except the 1♦ response which can be weak with 0-7 or balanced 16+ with no 4-card Major. Some of the 1♣ opener’s rebids are also shown. (1.1) 1♣-1♦ 0-7, or Balanced 16+ with no 4-card Major 1♥ 12-17, 4-card ♥, may have weak 5+ cards ♦ 1♠ 12-17, 4-card ♠, may have weak 5+ cards ♦ 1NT 18-19, Balanced 2♣ GF 55, or Balanced 23+ 2♦ 12-17, Good 5+ cards ♦ and one not-yet-specified 4-card Major 2♥ 18-19, ♥+♠/♦/♣ 55 2♠ 18-19, ♠+minor 55 2NT 20-22, Balanced 3♣ 18-22, minor 55 3♦ 20-22, Major 55 3♥ 20-22, ♥+minor 55 3♠ 20-22, ♠+minor 55 (1.2) 1♣-1♥ 8+, 4+ cards ♥ 1♠ 12-17, 4-card ♠, may have weak 5+ cards ♦ 1NT 18-19, Balanced 2♣ GF 55, or Balanced 23+ 2♦ 15-17, Good 5+ cards ♦ and 4-card ♠ 2♥ 12-14, 4 card ♥ 2♠ 18-19, ♠+minor 55 2NT 20-22, Balanced 3♣ 18-19, minor 55 3♦ 20-22, minor 55 3♥ 15-16, 4-card ♥ 3♠ 20-22, ♠+minor 55 3NT Splinter-♠, 4-card ♥ 4♣ Splinter-♣, 4-card ♥ 4♦ Splinter-♦, 4-card ♥ 4♥ Good 16-17, 4-card ♥ 4NT RKC-♥ (1.3) 1♣-1♠ 8+, 4+ cards ♠ (1.4) 1♣-1NT 8-10, Balanced with no 4-card Major 2♣ GF 55, or Balanced 23+ 2♦ 12-17, Good 5+ cards ♦ and one not-yet-specified 4-card Major 2♥ 18-19, ♥+♠/♦/♣ 55 2♠ 18-19, ♠+minor 55 2NT 20-22, Balanced 3♣ 18-19, minor 55 3♦ 20-22, minor 55 3♥ 20-22, ♥+♠/♦/♣ 55 3♠ 20-22, ♠+minor 55 3NT 18-19, Balanced (1.5) 1♣-2♣ 11+, 5+ cards ♣, may have one 4-card Major 2♦ 12-17, 5+ cards ♦ and one not-yet-specified 4-card Major 2♥ 12-17, 4 cards ♥ 2♠ 12-17, 4 cards ♠ 2NT 12-14, Balanced 3♣ 12-14, 3+ cards ♣ 3♦ 18-19, ♠+♥ 55 3♥ 18-19, ♥+♦ 55 3♠ 18-19, ♠+♦ 55 3NT 18-19, Balanced 4♣ 15-16, 4 cards ♣, invite 4♦ RKC-♣ 4♥ 20+, ♥+♠/♦ 55 4♠ 20+, ♠+♦ 55 4NT 20-22, Balanced 5♣ 16-17, 4 cards ♣ (1.6) 1♣-2♦ 11+, 5+ cards ♦, may have one 4-card Major (1.7) 1♣-2♥ 5-7, 6+ cards ♥ (1.8) 1♣-2♠ 5-7, 6+ cards ♠ (1.9) 1♣-2NT 11-12, Balanced with no 4-card Major (1.10) 1♣-3NT 13-15, Balanced with no 4-card Major The underlined responses to 1♦ bid are very similar to those to 1♣ bid, while the 1♦ opener’s rebids are quite different. (2.1) 1♦-1♥ 0-7, or Balanced 16+ with no 4-card Major 1♠ 12-17, Both Major 44, can be 4450 1NT 12-14, No 4-card Major (2344, 2353, 3325, 3334) 2♣ 18-21, One to-be-declared 5+ card suit (relay to 2♦ or bid ur suit) 2♦ 12-17, One 6+ cards ♦ suit or ♦+♣ 54 (1354, 2254) 2♥ 18-21, Any 4441 (Responder searches for 44 fit starting from Major) 2♠ 22+, One to-be-declared 5+ card suit (relay to 2N or bid ur suit) 2NT 22+, Any 4441 (Responder searches for 44 fit starting from Major) 3♣ 12-17 ♦+♣ 55/65/66 (2.2) 1♦-1♠ 8+, at least one 4+ cards unspecified Major 1NT 12-14, No 4-card Major (2344, 2353, 3325, 3334) 2♣ 18-21, One to-be-declared 5+ card suit (relay to 2♦ or bid ur suit) 2♦ 12-17, One 6+ cards ♦ suit or ♦+♣ 54 (1354, 2254) 2♥ 12-17, Both Major 44, can be 4450. 2♠ 22+, One to-be-declared 5+ suit (relay to 2N or bid ur suit) 2NT 22+, Any 4441 (Responder searches for 44 fit starting from Major) 3♣ 12-17 ♦+♣ 55/65/66 3♦ 18-21 4441 3♥ 18-21 1444 3♠ 18-21 4144 3NT 18-21 4414 (2.3) 1♦-1NT 8-10, Balanced with no 4-card Major 2♣ 18-21, One to-be-declared 5+ suit (relay to 2♦) 2♦ 12-17, 5+ cards ♦ 2♥ TBD ???? 2♠ 22+, One to-be-declared 5+ card suit (relay to 2N) 2NT 22+, Any 4441 (Responder searches for 44 fit starting from Major) 3♣ 12-17, ♦+♣, 55/65/66 3♦ 18-21, 4441 3♥ 18-21, 1444 3♠ 18-21, 4144 3NT 18-21, 4414 (2.4) 1♦-2♣ 11+, 5+ cards ♣, may have 4-card Major 2♦ 12-17, 5+ cards ♦ 2♥ 12-17, Major 44 2♠ 22+, One to-be-declared 5+ card suit (relay to 2N or bid ur suit) 2NT 22+, 4441 (no fit) 3♣ 12-14, 3+ cards ♣ 3♦ 18-21, 5+ cards ♦ 3♥ 18-21, 5+ cards ♥ 3♠ 18-21, 5+ cards ♠ 3NT 18-21, 4441 (no fit) 4♣ 15-16, 4 cards ♣, invite 4♦ 18-21, 4414 4♥ 18-21, 1444 4♠ 18-21, 4144 4NT RKC-♣ 5♣ 16-17, 4 cards ♣ (2.5) 1♦-2♦ 11+, 5+ cards ♦, may have 4-card Major (2.6) 1♦-2♥ 5-7, 6+ cards ♥ (2.7) 1♦-2♠ 5-7, 6+ cards ♠ (2.8) 1♦-2NT 11-12, Balanced with no 4-card Major (2.9) 1♦-3NT 13-15, Balanced with no 4-card Major

In the previously posted (Sept 6, 2020) TRANSFER style responses to the strong 2C opening, the responses fell into two categories, balanced hands and unbalanced hands. There are, however, 3 possible types of unbalanced hands to deal with. (1) 1 single 5+ suit (2) 2 suits 55 or better (3) 3 suits (4441) With only 8 bidding steps between 2C and 3NT, the responder will be very lucky to have a chance to show the 2nd suit under 3NT, and almost impossible the 3rd suit in the 4441 case. To better use the bidding space, the 2♥ bid can be designated to show both cases (2) or (3). Therefore, the new improved responses to the strong 2C opening become 2D 0-4 Hcps, Negative 2♥ 4+ Hcps, GF, 2 suitors (55) or 3 suitors (4441) 2S 4+ Hcps, GF, balanced hand 2N 4+ Hcps, GF, 5+ card Club 3C 4+ Hcps, GF, 5+ card Diamond 3D 4+ Hcps, GF, 5+ card Heart 3H 4+ Hcps, GF, 5+ card Spade After 2C-2♥, the opener will bid (a) 2S/3C/3D/3H to show the 5+ card suit. (b) 2NT/3NT to show the 22-24 or 25+ balanced hand. The responder’s next bidding for case (a) can be shown with the help of 2C-2♥-3D example. 3H 4-6 or 10+, S+C 55 (Not D or H, the other 2 suits) 3S 4-6 or 10+, C+H 55 4C 4-6 or 10+, H+S 55 4H 7-9, S+C 55 4S 7-9, C+H 55 5C 7-9, S+H 55 3N 4-9, 4414 4N 10+, 4414 4D 8+, Dx3+ 5D 4-7, Dx3+ The responder’s next bidding for case (b) of 2C-2♥-2NT/3NT can be a little bit complicated. I like responder's 3C/4C for 4441 with various strengths, while bidding a suit at the lowest level in transfer style to show 55. That is to say, 3D means H suit plus C/D/S suit 55. I will leave it to your partnership to define your preferred responses if you like this 2C-2♥ convention. Have fun!

Indeed, in the transfer response approach, when the response is 3D showing 4+ with 5+ card H, the opener has limit bidding space before going beyond 3NT. 2C 3D ? However, The opener may be in a better position to make a decision of bidding 3NT or his own suit of 3S/4C/4D than what the responder can do in the 2D waiting example below. In the 2D waiting approach, when the bidding goes like 2C 2D 3D ? What will the responder bid holding 4-5 hcps, 3415 or 3316? Should the responder bid 3NT to wrong side the contract before even knowing opener's holding at H and S? or Should the responder bypass 3NT and bid 4C? There are always those extreme cases people need to know when using a "system". We all know there is no perfect system as the key constrain is the limited amount of available biddings . How to come up with a simpler "system" that will cover most of the possible holdings without too much trade-off can be a very good academic research project. Guess that is one of the reasons why bridge is such a fun game!

Your suggestion of not having an opening that is strong in all cases is strategically correct, as the opps have a difficult time to come in. The approach of adding a weak or mini NT hand into the strong 1C bid has actually been done by the Polish Club's 1C bid which is either 12-17 with certain type of holding or any 18+ hands. The problem with using the same approach at the higher level 2C bid is that you may have to play 3-level contract too frequently than you normally would. Of course, one can argue that opps may be robbed with their contract.

In the new TRANSFER response approach, if you like the responder's suit, you will bid his suit and be the declarer. If you like your suit better than responder's suit, you will bid your suit and be the declarer too. In the 2D waiting approach, you will be the declarer when you bid your suit. However, if responder does not like your suit and bids his own suit and you happen to support his suit, then the responder will be the declarer. That is the difference!!