oh cmon, this 8-5 distribution is 1 in million chance it should come out, and nothing in ordinary convention cover it. and u say 2h or 4h showing 5-6 or 5-7?. this is like telling that if u have 13 cards all ♥, 1 suit only from 2 to ace, 10 pts, u should pass? not bid 7♥?? THIS IS SPECIAL CASE. the bidding convention create by rule of LOGIC. if somehow u cant use convention due to the 'weird hand', u just need to get back to LOGIC. for me, this is how i see that 8-5 hand: - regardless ur partner points, that hand alone minimum worth 4h contract. - so if u can manage to probe ur partner hand and points, there's a chance to slam. - luckily, ur partner bid first, so u know north have 12 pts ish. - wishful thinking north have 2 aces, ♥ and ♦, u have slam. -so ur effort should be thinking how to make ur partner spill his/her ♦, ♥, and aces. - this is special case, and bidding mode is: u ask - ur partner answer, like 1nt bidding.